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Post by yanmacca on Sept 10, 2019 18:44:10 GMT
Great photos Steve, they show middle coulee as a major contender for Custer’s rout to MTC. That animal in the shot, looks like one of those very expensive ponies, a dear horse
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Post by deadwoodgultch on Sept 12, 2019 10:13:33 GMT
Ian, this past Summer Steve and I went out on what I will call a flat or loaf on the northeast end of Weir. The view down from there gives you a good common sense seam to follow, you can also see some eroded dead ends. Speaking of seams we also visited a rise just off of Hwy 212 maybe 400 yards from battle ridge with a good view of the seams and folds that could/would have been used as cover to rain fire on the soldiers. Maps are great but nothing like being on the ground or riding it as Steve has. Even from this distance you can't appreciate the steepness of the swale in which Keogh met his demise after Crazy Horse traversed the gap in BR. They would have been blown up, by the down hill rush.
Regards, Tom
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mac
Brigadier General
Posts: 1,790
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Post by mac on Sept 12, 2019 11:45:08 GMT
Tom is certainly right about the terrain; as I have said before, it changed completely my ideas about how things could unfold. Steve Middle looks inviting. I have no problem with Custer doing some kind of scout but am not keen for it to be as Thompson relates. Certainly I can accept that Custer was hoping to get across at Ford B, but some kind of recon would have him stay well away. Martini may have got into MTC and I think you will tell me that Middle exits around the 600 mark . In the thread on E, F movements I asked about Maguire and the SSL, just in case you missed it. Late for me. Cheers
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Post by yanmacca on Sept 12, 2019 15:38:25 GMT
Yes Tom, the eastern side of battle ridge certainly looks totally different from the western face.
Mac, I will try to match up the routes of the McGuire map to a more modern one showing the markers, it will be difficult though so don't expect a result soon.
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Post by yanmacca on Oct 15, 2019 11:48:19 GMT
Our old pal HR, has posted this image on the black board, but as far as I know, he has not posted it here. Apparently it shows the Custer route north and the route taken by Wolftooth when he left the village to find the soldiers. Now I don't know how thruthful this image is, because I would have guessed that WT would have gone a lot further then this, before Custer had even got to deep coulee. One last thing which has been dogging me and no relation to my post above, but we read about how the Indians multilated the soldiers after killing them, one of the reasons for this was down to chopping the person up so if you met them again in the afterlife, he would havve no limbs to attack you with, but hang on, if every Indian did this act after they killed a trooper, wouldnt it take ages for the warriors to do this act? You also read how the women did the mutilations, did they expect to see these men again in the after life? The only other option, is that the warriors went searching for the men they killed after the battle, but how did they remember the place or the troop. Anyway enough of this grusome talk, here is HRs image;
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Post by deadwoodgultch on Oct 15, 2019 17:14:33 GMT
What limbs or appendages would the women be concerned about?
Regards, Tom
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Post by deadwoodgultch on Oct 15, 2019 17:18:07 GMT
It's just me, but I feel that WT engaged prior to MTC. This is no nock on JSIT.
Regards, Tom
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mac
Brigadier General
Posts: 1,790
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Post by mac on Oct 16, 2019 10:47:50 GMT
I am working on memory here but I think Wolftooth and his pals traveled the route shown on the map. My memory is that they saw Custer before MTC but then followed him at a distance before deciding on the attack point. Cheers
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Post by yanmacca on Oct 16, 2019 11:01:41 GMT
Yeah Mac, thats what I was thinking too. Didn't they leave well before Reno made his attack, so wouldn't they have made better ground in that time. If my memory serves me well , didn't the camp guards bring them back because the soldiers had been spotted?
To me the account given by JSIT says it all for me, because at the point Wolftooth was recalled by the camp guards, he then turned towards MTC/Ridge line or deep coulee or whatever, only to see the soldiers disappearing down a coulee, so this shows that they had passed him, which is further evidence to show that they Wolftooth band had gone further then that drawing represents.
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