mac
Brigadier General
Posts: 1,790
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Post by mac on Oct 29, 2015 21:20:17 GMT
I once had a short period when if I did not hunt I did not eat. The secret is to be efficient in what you are doing and only kill what you need. Beyond that animal rights are really important as is respect for life and gratitude to the animal. My understanding is that NA had a post hunt ceremony of thanks to the animal. I like that. Cheers
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Post by Beth on Oct 29, 2015 22:23:14 GMT
That and use all of the animal possible. I have no problem with hunting. I do have a problem with people who just hunt for trophies. There is a huge difference between hunting for sustenance and hunting for ego. If all one is using only of say--an African lion is it's hide for mounting in a 'man cave' then chances are they are hunting for their ego.
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dave
Brigadier General
Posts: 1,679
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Post by dave on Oct 29, 2015 23:36:10 GMT
Mac I agree that hunting humanely and wisely is the responsibility of a true hunter. I have always shared the meat from my hunts and fishing trips with family and friends and wasted nothing. I took pride in my equipment and behavior and it is the obligation of every hunter to behave properly.
Beth I believe we have long ago harvested enough "sample" creatures for museums and university collections like the Ornithology Collection at Harvard. Individuals like the dentist who shot Cecil the lion. There are many animals available for hunting that are not endangered, near threatened or vulnerable that ego hunters may seek. Regards Dave PS Fried frog legs are delicious and good for you.
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Post by Beth on Oct 30, 2015 0:11:32 GMT
Mac I agree that hunting humanely and wisely is the responsibility of a true hunter. I have always shared the meat from my hunts and fishing trips with family and friends and wasted nothing. I took pride in my equipment and behavior and it is the obligation of every hunter to behave properly. Beth I believe we have long ago harvested enough "sample" creatures for museums and university collections like the Ornithology Collection at Harvard. Individuals like the dentist who shot Cecil the lion. There are many animals available for hunting that are not endangered, near threatened or vulnerable that ego hunters may seek. Regards Dave PS Fried frog legs are delicious and good for you. Or if you want the thrill of the hunt do a photo safari.
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dave
Brigadier General
Posts: 1,679
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Post by dave on Oct 30, 2015 0:46:08 GMT
Beth Many times while duck hunting I would be fascinated watching them come in to the decoys that I would forget to shoot. They are beautiful flyers. Regards Dave
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Post by deadwoodgultch on Oct 30, 2015 11:29:37 GMT
Dave,
While duck hunting, I have as much or more enjoyment watching dogs work. Goose breast, to me, is every bit as good as a filet, when prepared properly.
regards, Tom
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Post by yanmacca on Oct 30, 2015 11:45:17 GMT
Tom have you ever had a five bird roast? I have not got round to trying it but I promise myself every Christmas that we will have one, but the idea always gets dropped in favour of the traditional turkey. Five bird roast smallest stuffed into the larger in this order;
Pigeon stuffed with sausage meat Pheasant Chicken Turkey Goose
There is a lager one that includes quail, guinea fowl and partridge, but one must really rich to treat one’s self to such delights, we just do a Turkey, maybe a leg of pork if I can get one from a farm and a ham, that does us right through from Christmas day, Twixmas to New year’s day.
Yan.
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Post by deadwoodgultch on Oct 30, 2015 12:21:36 GMT
Yan, No I have not. I have seen commercial Turdukin, Turkey, Duck, and Chicken. The two inner birds are boned. Cabela's offers these in Christmas catalogue. I am sure someone in England offers this as well.
Regards, Tom
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Post by Beth on Oct 30, 2015 20:29:10 GMT
both turducken and the 5 bird roast sound delicious in theory but man how do you cook bird stuffed with bird stuffed with bird and get everything to the right temp to avoid salmonella?
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Post by yanmacca on Oct 31, 2015 12:33:07 GMT
I know Beth, if you don't make sure that they are all cooked through, then food poisoning would be a key issue, the other thing is that if you cook it too long then the out side birds will be over cooked and dry, what also puts me off is the sauces, now I am a traditionalist when it comes to sauces and gravy and each of the birds involved are usually served with a different sauce or condiment, for instant you would need apple sauce for the Goose, stuffing for the chicken, cranberry for the turkey and I suppose some sort of sweet fruit jelly for the game birds (pigeon, partridge, quail, guinea fowl or pheasant), don't ask me were the bread sauce of gravy goes.
Yan.
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Post by Beth on Oct 31, 2015 17:52:36 GMT
those would be some very saucy birds.
Do you pour the sauces over the birds like gravy or are they eaten at the side?
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Post by yanmacca on Oct 31, 2015 18:33:03 GMT
The apple, cranberry stuffing and jelly would normally be on the side, things like sauce or gravy go on top and everywhere, but you know the score Beth, when you make a gravy you use the meat juices of that particular piece of meat along with flour and colouring and that echos the taste of the meat and that both the gravy and meat sit well together, but with a five bird roast your gravy would have five different tastes all together, so I would have to taste it to see what sauce or condiment would sit best, I personally would go for cranberry, that would sit well with all of them.
Yan.
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Post by Beth on Oct 31, 2015 19:46:46 GMT
Cranberry goes with everything. I tend to think of things like that 5 bird dish or turducken to be more displays of someone's ability rather than an exercise in producing something eatable. You can find references to the bird dish you mentioned during the Georgian era but history is full of similar example. Can you imagine what it says about a person's wealth when he can put five birds in one dish (there would be a whole lot more on the table besides the birds probably at least fish and venison plus vegetable sides--and perhaps more than one remove (meal courses) at a time when many people struggled to put just a simple meal on the table?
To return to Custer sort of...
One of the reasons used to justify removing the NA from their lands was because they were sitting on prime land for pioneering and farming. Yet if you have ever been into that area of the country you would realize that farming it would be a real hard scrabble life--and even ranching-it requires a large expanse of land for each bovine produced. (a Montana rancher once gave me a rough formula that in the midwest you could keep 40 head of cattle on one acre but in his area you figured 40 acres per one head of cattle) It wasn't until irrigation techniques were developed and put were developed that it became really farmable land.
I suspect that a lot of the push to settle the area was supported by the railroads so they would have a reason establish more rails. The Army and the railroads had a very cosy relationship throughout the 19th century. Some of it you could justify as being necessary for the military to move men and supplies, but not all.
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dave
Brigadier General
Posts: 1,679
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Post by dave on Oct 31, 2015 20:31:14 GMT
Beth Railroads were given large tracts of land by the government as well as low interest loans. The railroads brought the immigrants to the plains and the west coast to procure gold, lumber and other precious metals and then sold them land to live on. The army certainly had a close relationship with the railroads as did many politicians. One can only imagine the graft and back room deals made. Regards Dave
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