Custer Moves to Ford D with Five Companies Part A

[yanmacca]

I suppose if the soldiers yielded ground then the Indians would occupy it.

I brought up the topic of the ravine and its name a while ago and someone said it was Crazy Horse Ravine, but you can see that CHR is well east of BRE and the ravine mentioned virtually splits BRE and CR.

I would guess that either all or just two of Custer's companies moved down that ravine in an effort to reach the river as it looks just as good of a natural highway to ford D then MTC does to ford B.

I would say that both F and E at one time held cemetery ridge and the Indians drove a wedge between the two companies, otherwise we would see more E company men dead on LSH.

If we look at the total number of identified men out of E company, the total reaches ten, so I would guess that the total of 28 men found dead in a ravine comes from the total number of men in company E (38 all ranks), minus the ten named.

[yanmacca]

I am disappointed with the results of this map, but the best ones are only available if you throw dollars at them;

[yanmacca]

No elevation lines on this one;

[quincannon]

That's just dandy Ian. It shows exactly the area that I was concerned with and you don't even have to mark the roads and trails as they are quite clear.

Referring to your first map

Now if you would be so good as to take that blue marker of yours out and:

Draw a skirmish line between that trail junction west of the cemetery to that green space you see where the entrance road splits into two lanes for a short way. That represents the speculated upon Company F line. Then place a blue dot on the north corner of the visitors center. That represents a likely place to stash the Company F horses.

Now take as a starting point the Y shaped trail junction draw a blue line toward the writing at the bottom of the page, and a blue dot behind that line just over the western boundary line of the cemetery. That represents the speculated position of Company E and horses.

Will adjust.

[yanmacca]

Chuck you will have to guide me, as I am guessing here;

[quincannon]

Not that map Ian the first one.

Company F --- A line between the Y trail junction and where the lanes split in the park entrance road. Horses about where the cemetery ends along the entrance road and the visitors center. That puts the horses right in the present parking lot and you can see that clearly in the map you just used.

Company E --- A line between the Y trail intersection and the writing at the bottom a the map page. Horses behind them at the west wall of the cemetery.

Remember these were small units so while I gave you the company boundaries the actual line will be between the features I mentioned but not nearly touching them from side to side.

Use only one blue line not two parallel lines.

[yanmacca]

Is this close?

[quincannon]

Right on the money. Shorten each skirmish line up just a bit and you are good to go.

[yanmacca]

Done;

[quincannon]

When you finish that, lets see how it looks.

Then draw two red arrows one coming up the old park entrance road toward the Y and then to the Company E horses, and the second coming up the trail from the gravel pit to the Y and then on toward the Company E horses. That should effectively split Companies E and F and the Company F horses being out of sight accounts for why they too were not gone after at that point in the battle.

What then will be graphically portrayed is Company E's right flank being turned forcing them back off of Cemetery Ridge, and Company F's left flank being turned forcing them back upon their horses, and then the whole being forced up the face of Battle Ridge to the LSH area.

[quincannon]

Everyone keep in mind what these last few posts have been is nothing more than speculation on what might have happened. I am not yet prepared to bet the rent money on it.

As an example of another variation of the above. we could have had Company C occupying the positions marked above for Company F. Remember there were Company C cartridge finds located very nearby. In that event I would have expected to find Company F located in a reserve position between the visitors center and LSH, and probably still mounted. That would put the other two companies I and L over on BRE.

[yanmacca]

I hope I have got the locations right because there are two old roads leading to the cemetery;

[mac]

This is really good team work gentlemen. Pretty much what I see in my mind, especially the split of the two companies. Remember we had earlier the account of the soldiers lined up like an L...there it is.
I think the split is accomplished by the lower red arrow. I think it likely the top arrow from BRE probably stayed more towards LSH, with the Cemetery Ridge line alone threatening (breaking) the whole position.
If Company C were on the right flank of Company F and they had thinned their line and slipped away down the back of Battle Ridge then that would cause the Company F line to have to also cover more of the BRE action. Then when Company I thinned and withdrew, the split would be generated as Company F was even more intent on BRE.
Remembering that Company E may also need to be looking left from their position; one can easily see how the Company E horses are scattered as the two Companies are split.
More later.
Cheers

[quincannon]

There ladies and gentlemen is your SPLIT as told in those ancient feathered tales. One runs up. One runs down.

These tales also told of four companies (groups - units - etc.). Where is number five? Without getting long and drawn out, every commander tries to keep a reserve. Number five could have been a reserve, and not be readily seen by an observer approaching up hill against fire.

If that was the case, I would think that Companies E and F would operate together, and Companies C and I doing the same, leaving Company L as a reserve. In that event the most likely deployment for E and F would be something like that seen on Ian's map, while C and I would be somewhat similarly deployed on BRE. Company L would probably occupy a position dead center in the second Wagner picture that Mac dug up a link to

Again speculation, but reading what Mac posted about science, aren't we all nothing more than test fitters?

Ian, again you came through with the maps and graphics. Thanks and well done.

[quincannon]

We must now, sometime soon, take on the BRE portion of this fight to give some clarity to what we all think ended up in a withdrawal to the positions that Companies C, I, and L were found.

To do this we will need a map similar to the one the graphics for E and F are on showing CR, BRE and the park entrance road meandering between. It must extend from the trading post to the base of LSH. We will probably need it in a smaller scale, testing all of our old eyes, for it is a large area to be covered.

I think it needs to cover the area mentioned, because more and more I think the right portion of this action was more mobile, a reverse of the left (E-F) sector. You must make allowances I feel, for the bodies/artifacts found down by the trading post, then come back up BRE to where more artifacts of both sides were found higher up the expanse of that ridge in the direction of LSH. It was most likely a game of movement by bounds.