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Post by miker on Jan 25, 2023 16:55:31 GMT
I understand your position. Regardless of motivation, capability, intent, and marksmanship it all came to naught and therefore makes no difference.
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Post by quincannon on Jan 25, 2023 17:03:28 GMT
Oh contraire mon frere, it makes all the difference. Dying well, as opposed to being labeled a sniveling coward, makes a very big difference in my mind.
We have had a hundred forty seven years of another respected NCO, SGT Kanipe, being vilified by the likes of Fred Wagner and Bill Rini, with absolutely no reason to do so. It must stop, if we are to have a clear conscience.
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Post by miker on Jan 25, 2023 17:24:59 GMT
Don’t take what I’m saying the wrong way. I’m not vilifying anyone. Their effort came to naught and made no difference in the battle. Butler and Bobo along with others undoubtedly performed with valor and should be decorated, if there was anyone who could attest to their performance.
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Post by quincannon on Jan 25, 2023 17:46:52 GMT
I fully agree. Had Bulter survived he would have probably been awarded the Medal of Honor based on the standards of the day. If you can get one for carrying water, riding in an attempt to save a good portion of your regiment certainly merits such an award.
I jumped on this because of how Kanipe was treated over the years. When one makes a statement, there is a certain percentage of people who will take it wrong, based upon their own personal prejudices. I obviously knew none of these men, but throwing brickbats because someone cannot figure out what they were doing by simple deduction, and paying attention to the totality of circumstances they found themselves in says more about the people offering vile critical remarks than anything else.
For the record Mike, I put your comments down as "I don't know" which is I believe how you intended them.
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Post by miker on Jan 25, 2023 18:06:08 GMT
Understood.
A long time ago in the 11th grade, in a classroom not so far away, my civics instructor had occasion to tell us “All men are valorous and all ladies are virtuous.”
I try to maintain that unless I see or know of verified behavior to the contrary. In an argument about John Kerry’s valor which was being impinged by a retired Colonel, I said words to the effect of “I find reasons to despise Kerry, but I do not dispute his valor any more than I dispute yours. “
I later had to defend Hilary’s virtue in the same way, but I depose her as well.
I also believe I label my assumptions as such to distinguish them from facts using words like assume, believe, think, suppose, appears, may … etc. Assumptions can be questioned. Facts cannot. Alternative facts are assumptions in most cases, but in some case can be proven, thus becoming a fact.
Just because someone doesn’t like a fact doesn’t change it.
I currently don’t believe Custer tried to get to Ford D. I think he was stopped. The picture I posted in another thread disrupts my thinking. Hopefully the book I have ordered will have facts and then may have to rethink my scenario based on things found in the ground and verified.
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Post by quincannon on Jan 25, 2023 18:41:53 GMT
I think he tried and was stopped. If he was stopped then logic would tell you he was trying to go somewhere, and the only somewhere up there worth a smidgen of pig shit, in a tactical sense, is Ford D. The only question then remaining is where was he stopped. My take is the old park road. Mac thinks in the valley floor. Others suggest he never got beyond LSH. Still others, and I am not quite in that camp yet, think it was the Trading Post, home of the Death Burger, and he was so blown asunder because he paid more attention to the variety of souvenir T shirts on sale, rather than tending to business.
By the way I have found an outstanding NATO Green, Mission Models out of California. Michigan Toy Soldier has it by mail order if it is not available locally in FL. Luckily I have two local sources here in the Springs.
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Post by rollingthunder on Jan 25, 2023 19:24:46 GMT
Still others, and I am not quite in that camp yet, think it was the Trading Post, home of the Death Burger, and he was so blown asunder because he paid more attention to the variety of souvenir T shirts on sale, rather than tending to business. a little humor never hurts... hahahahahahahaa
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Post by quincannon on Jan 25, 2023 21:02:42 GMT
If you ever consumed a Death Burger Pachi, you would not think it was so damned funny. I give the TP a lot of negative heat, but their selection of subject matter related books is excellent.
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Post by miker on Jan 25, 2023 21:21:24 GMT
Is there a website for the trading post? I'm always looking for new books to read.
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Post by quincannon on Jan 25, 2023 22:07:52 GMT
Don't know, maybe Steve does. He likes the food. Just don't order a cheeseburger mail order. On second thought, it may taste better once the grease is absorbed by the plain brown wrapping paper.
Seriously, I bought all my Greene's there, and I would say they carried twenty to thirty that dealt directly with the Indian Wars, with emphasis of course on LBH.
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Post by miker on Jan 26, 2023 0:21:08 GMT
Well, I found it. laststand.com/The book selection is somewhat limited and I see no need to send them my money anytime soon.
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Post by quincannon on Jan 26, 2023 2:29:59 GMT
It sure was not limited when I was there. They did not have the Bible or Gone With The Wind, both of which was disappointing, but if Custer's name was mentioned anywhere in the tome they seemed to have it.
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Post by miker on Jan 26, 2023 2:39:17 GMT
They have 56 books. Some of which I have. I have some they don't. Not all deal with the LBH but do deal with ancillary subjects.
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