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Post by deadwoodgultch on Apr 25, 2017 12:12:09 GMT
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Tarawa
Apr 26, 2017 14:15:41 GMT
via mobile
Post by BrevetorCoffin on Apr 26, 2017 14:15:41 GMT
Great stuff Tom. Thank you for sharing.
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Post by quincannon on Apr 26, 2017 16:44:51 GMT
Unfortunately these things happen in war.
I don't know a whole lot about Tarawa, specifically Betio, other than the Marines that fought there were pulled off fairly quickly after the island fell. I have attempted to find something out about the follow on forces, who went in and made a base from the battlefield. I have had no luck, but I would expect them to be Naval Construction Battalions. The Marines leaving very early is probably the root cause of the problem, and the coral of the island in all probability made it very hard, if not impossible to construct a proper grave. Therefore my opinion would be that those bodies are beneath the airfield and its associated structures, and will probably never be recovered, save in ones and twos.
There was a similar article in the New York Times a fair while back.
In a way this does not upset me as much as it may others. The Unknown Soldiers represent them, and homage is paid to the unknowns of our twentieth century wars an a 24/7/365 basis. I don't know how many of you have visited Arlington, but there is a nobility expressed in that place, where the Unknowns are everyone's son, and the idea of the unknown warrior, representing all the nations sons gone off to war, to me, is something I do not have words to describe.
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Tarawa
Apr 26, 2017 21:42:58 GMT
via mobile
Post by BrevetorCoffin on Apr 26, 2017 21:42:58 GMT
Unfortunately these things happen in war. I don't know a whole lot about Tarawa, specifically Betio, other than the Marines that fought there were pulled off fairly quickly after the island fell. I have attempted to find something out about the follow on forces, who went in and made a base from the battlefield. I have had no luck, but I would expect them to be Naval Construction Battalions. The Marines leaving very early is probably the root cause of the problem, and the coral of the island in all probability made it very hard, if not impossible to construct a proper grave. Therefore my opinion would be that those bodies are beneath the airfield and its associated structures, and will probably never be recovered, save in ones and twos. There was a similar article in the New York Times a fair while back. In a way this does not upset me as much as it may others. The Unknown Soldiers represent them, and homage is paid to the unknowns of our twentieth century wars an a 24/7/365 basis. I don't know how many of you have visited Arlington, but there is a nobility expressed in that place, where the Unknowns are everyone's son, and the idea of the unknown warrior, representing all the nations sons gone off to war, to me, is something I do not have words to describe. Moving to say the least and changing of the guard is special.
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Post by quincannon on Apr 27, 2017 14:23:33 GMT
Whenever I go there I make it a point to visit the place where a couple of hundred U S Army soldiers that were killed at Chantilly on 1 September 1862 are interred. All of them are unknown. The place is special to me in that I once lived where they fought. They in a way made it possible for Virginia to grow, for me to grow, and I am grateful.
Yes the changing of the Guard, by the Old Guard is very special. There are few places in this country that are must visits for every American, Williamsburg, where you can see and appreciate the genesis of republican democracy is one, The Tomb of the Unknowns, where we are reminded that what we have comes at great price is another.
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Post by Beth on Apr 27, 2017 22:55:36 GMT
As Dave can tell you my great great grandfather is a Civil War unknown soldier, he died in his first battle at Shiloh probably minutes after arriving on the battlefield. Whenever I am in a military cemetery attached to a battlefield, each one of those unknowns has a personal meaning to me because I understand how each stone marks a person who had a history and a family and how those lives lost left a hole in the family's life that could be felt for generations. Each unknown represents all those an empty chairs at the table, a full life history unfulfilled, grandchildren unmet and no tales to pass on other than 'he died at ..." The unknown gave their all in those battles but the families also continued to pay for those loses for the rest of their lives.
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dave
Brigadier General
Posts: 1,679
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Post by dave on Apr 28, 2017 0:20:51 GMT
When visiting Arlington be sure and go see the Confederate Memorial designed by Moses Ezekiel a VMI cadet veteran of the New Market battle. Regardless of your views regarding the War, remember they were mostly young men who had never traveled far from home, poorly educated and influenced by family, religion and personal experiences and beliefs. My own GGGrandfather who was captured after the Battle of Dinwiddie Court House was sent to the POW Camp on Hart Island in NYC. He died in May 1865 and is buried in Cypress Hills National Cemetery in Brooklyn. I can only imagine the heated discussions held over having Confederates buried with the loyal troops. Standing on the hill over looking JFK's grave into DC is a beautiful sight. I listed a site below which contains info regarding LBH veterans buried in Arlington. Regards Dave arlingtoncemetery.net/custer.htm
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Post by BrevetorCoffin on Apr 28, 2017 17:32:28 GMT
I feel everyone's empathy with those who gave their lives and their families and friends. For the record I am aware of 2 distant relatives from my mother's side of the family who served in the ACW: US Grant (yes, THAT US Grant) and Joel Elliott who would die at the Washita Battle. Dad's family was still residing in St Helen's near Liverpool during rhe Civil War.
The only military experience on Dad's side of the family, that I know of, were Grandad who served in the Royal Navy during WWI and Dad who served in WWII, Korea and Viet Nam when it was still called French Indochina. May they both rest in peace and I am grateful they both survived their wartime experiences.
Brother Dave, I am glad to have gotten to see that view from JFK's gravesite. You could not get close to the grave in 1963 it was so jam packed with people wanting to pay their respects. Got to see it in 1998, 35 years after the assassination. Well worth the wait!
QC, I lived in VA years ago; Annandale from 1963-66 and the US Naval Surface Laboratory at Dahlgren from 1966-68. Nothing quite like hearing the big guns go off and machine guns chatter from 5 miles away in the "Restricted Area".
This discussion has brought back a lot of memories.
Best,
David
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Post by Beth on Apr 28, 2017 19:35:57 GMT
My own GGGrandfather who was captured after the Battle of Dinwiddie Court House was sent to the POW Camp on Hart Island in NYC. He died in May 1865 and is buried in Cypress Hills National Cemetery in Brooklyn. I can only imagine the heated discussions held over having Confederates buried with the loyal troops. In the end, they were all soldiers who were doing their duty to the best of their ability and deserve each other's mutual respect. After the last gun has been fired, it is essential to start finding our commonality and not differences if we are going to survive on a very small planet.
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Post by yanmacca on Apr 30, 2017 10:18:07 GMT
After the battle on Betio, the 6th Marine Regiment left their 2nd Battalion behind to clear the ground of ordnance plus provide security and bury the many bodies which were left behind. The Seabee units which followed behind the assault force, was the 18th Seabee Battalion, and I think 290 men from this battalion joined the Engineers from the 2nd Marines to get the place ship shape. The lead elements of the 18th Seabees actually landed on Tarawa on D-Plus-2, and were under fire as they repaired the air strip.
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